After seeing two renditions of it, I ran over to the Butterick site to purchase this pattern. I knew I could alter my TNT straight skirt pattern but I thought let me support the pattern industry. Let me purchase a pattern and make my own version of this pattern...alas it is not to be. Why? Why do you ask? Because this pattern only goes up to a size 20!
Okay I get it that pattern companies must make money. I also get that maybe plus size women are a "smaller" market, however, what I don't get is how you can design a simple straight skirt in a larger size, (B5574, B5466, B4461) but can't grade the trendier skirts up to a size 22, 24 or even Women's sizes?! Seriously, it's not like a little old man is sitting at a drafting table with paper and pencil drafting up each size! You know a machine is doing it...so why not program said machine to draft two or three more sizes?
Why would I purchase a new pattern that's not in my size, that I will need to make alterations to when I have a perfectly good, well-fitted pattern already on hand? So yes, I will be stealing this style and using it on my TNT skirt pattern. The pattern alterations aren't that hard for me to make...but what about a new sewist...someone just learning to sew or returning to sewing...m'thinks Butterick that not only did you lose a sale to me but you might have lost a lifelong customer in that new sewist!
I really like this version of the skirt:
...and that's why I use my TNT patterns so much!
More later!
Love the pattern and I like your suggested use. I'm going to look frward to seeing your version.
ReplyDeleteI don't think it is a smaller market; I recently heard there are 2 plus size women in the US to every 1 smaller size. I suspect it's the old enemy, sizism! It's even worse to be a 'bigger' woman here in the UK-the sizing here is brutal-many stores don't carry sizes above a US 12! Um, hello? So I look forward to your creations on many levels! Good luck!
ReplyDeleteNice skirt design, especially since I'm on a big skirt kick right now. Your talent with your TNT patterns is to be celebrated. I swear you make those patterns into ANY DESIGN!!! Knowing how to grade patterns up or down is what I call REAL talent. I'm about to grade a pattern up two sizes, and only hope I know what I'm doing.
ReplyDeleteI have found that the pattern co. are finally listening a bit more here and there. Go to their web sites.... write to them... complain.... aaaa lot! You may be surprised... like you say. it's just a machine/computer they are programing to do this... so give someone a bit of overtime and just do it!!! Good Luck! We know that you can come up with your own, but like you say there are new seamstress's that neat a bit more help... In the past when I have complained to the companies... not only do they try to help, they generally will send a voucher for a free pattern... which doesn't hurt! Thanks for all you do and inspire!
ReplyDeleteI bought this pattern at the last McCalls sale. It's in queue for 2011.
ReplyDeleteI look forward to your version of this skirt. It's a great pattern that would look so good on a size 22,24. Maybe Butterick will listen!
ReplyDeleteI share your thoughts about this pattern. I like the version with the darts. My plan is to modify my TNT pattern to add the darts. It is somewhere in the 2011 lineup.
ReplyDeleteI know your version of it will be beautiful... I too am frustrated by patterns that only go up to a size 20. I'm learning how to grade up, but truthfully it's time consuming - especially if you're just learning - and it can be discouraging!
ReplyDeleteI studied Advanced Grading at Technical College about the issue of Plus Size Grading. It's not as simplistic as telling the computer go up another 2 more sizes. When I was studying, we actually had to grade it seperately beyond size 18 and then re-examine the plus size grade 2 sizes up from there.
ReplyDeleteThe reasoning for this is that the uniform grade that is expected for the 8-18 range can not be directly applied to the plus size figure. The proportioning is slightly different, so things that may for example stay static in a size 8-18 range like a yoke, may need to increase because it may look too small in proportion to the rest of the garment. This means that plus size grading is more expensive than regular grading because it is inherently more complex.
Another thing one has to look at is how plus size bodies differ from smaller ones. For example pants - the crotch depth/width increase may be different to compensate girth. Ankle grade may also be different due to the fact the thighs tapering down may be different in proportion.
Of course, this is all from the perspective of garments that are tailored and detailed. This is probably why most plus size garments are shapeless and simple.
Another thing is that because smaller size grades have been heavily reasearched since the beginning of grading and taught at all fashion schools but plus size is a relatively new phenomena. It's only in this generation that it has started to become an issue. There is yet to be done a huge study of it and anyone who has, has kept it a closely guarded industrial secret.
Some of this is based on my studies and speculation, but I hope it is helpful.
Cecile
Kathleen Fasanella, a pattern maker who I believe you've blogged about, has explained the complexities of plus-size designing and grading. It's true that most pattern makers use CAD programs, but grading is not a matter of just adding a couple of inches here and there in some mathematically predictable pattern.
ReplyDeleteIf that were true, you wouldn't need a TNT pattern.
I see anonymous is back. ;) I love the view you decided upon. And you're right. You can just use your tnt. Can't wait to see it especially in the fabrics you described. :)
ReplyDeleteI like the sound of your version. And I am also surprised that pattern only goes up to a 20.
ReplyDeleteThankfully you can use your TNT.
My next project is a vintage pattern that is waaaaaaay too small for me. I bought it for the instructions and the design. I can use my TNT coat pattern as a basis.
I really wanted that pattern also, but didn't buy it because of the sizine - I need at least a 22, although a 24W would be so much better...Can't wait to see what you do - hoping to get some inspiration. One of my goals for 2011 is to develop TNT's for a dress, skirt and basic top..
ReplyDeleteso, THERE, Butterick patterns! Take that!
ReplyDeleteHonestly, you would probably end up fiddling w/ that Butterick pattern to get it to fit right, even in your size, that you be more efficient to modify your TNT.
Loss for them, gain for you!
You go girl!! I am peeved with them too but because they wouldnt alter the size on a request I made to buy a pattern online . I realized my mistake about a nanosecond after I pressed "send ". I was so angry and have no feelings of needing To support the pattern industry!!!!!!!
ReplyDeletethat one looks pretty easy peasy (for you anyway). Good luck. I might have a go myself too.
ReplyDeleteI cant wait to see your version! You inspire me with the way you work your TNTs!
ReplyDeleteBarrie in DC
Hopefully this comment won't show as anonymous, since I'd hate to be linked with the earlier anon poster.
ReplyDeleteI've been looking at this pattern for several days myself, wondering if there was a way I could make it work for me. I'm a 24W plus and have major issues with my tummy because of a somewhat botched c-section years ago.
I'll be looking closely to see how you grade this skirt pattern and may steal many of your ideas. I want a brown on brown version of the view you're copying and might even venture into one of the others for fun.
Looking forward to seeing what you do with this one! :)
Melissa in FL
It's a gorgeous pattern, and I reckon that you'll do a great job of it as always! I tend to steer away from any patterns with waist details because I never tuck anything in and I try to avoid drawing any sort of attention to my waist/stomach, so I can't wait to see what you do with your TNT and this pattern as inspiration.
ReplyDeleteIt shocks me when patterns only go up to a size 20. I wear a size 20 dress pattern... and a size 14 RTW. What's UP with that? It's not like you couldn't buy the same thing at the mall...
ReplyDeleteI always wonder what "they" really are saying. That want us to support them, want to bring new people to the home sewing market, but refuse to provide adequate instructions or grade up to common sizes. You may be a plus sized woman,, but you are not the only plus sized person. When will the pattern companies get it, if they want us to buy their patterns, they have to produce something that we can use.
ReplyDeleteI love the pattern and am anxious to see how you alter your TNT to this design. You inspire me to want to do more garment sewing. It is my goal to develop my own TNT patterns this year. Thanks for all the great posts.
ReplyDeleteAwesome use of the TNT! Burda did publish a pattern for a very similar skirt in the smaller sizes a couple of years ago. I can definitely see this in the black/black combo. I've seen a lot of leather and leather/wool combos in the higher end RTW lines.
ReplyDeleteOoh, I've been thinking of black leather and crepe for that view! Totally hot! And also completely not cool of Butterick to only go up to 20. This is really such a simple design. I agree with you that they have no excuse for that.
ReplyDeleteYou wrote:
ReplyDeleteSeriously, it's not like a little old man is sitting at a drafting table with paper and pencil drafting up each size! You know a machine is doing it...so why not program said machine to draft two or three more sizes?
I would *LOVE* to know where I can buy one of the machines you're describing. I've been making patterns in the garment industry for nearly 30 years and I've never heard of one. Hopefully, this machine (or program, I'd settle for that) you mention will cost less than the $40,000 or so dollars I've already spent on pattern CAD programs, upgrades and peripherals over the past 3 years.
In fact, in my continuing quest to find a still better and easier drafting and grading program, I just bought a new system last week ($8,500) and paid an additional several thousand dollars to fly in the company trainer to train me on it over the week end. This trainer has been making patterns even longer than me (40 years) and has worked on every single industrial CAD program there is and she doesn't know of a programmable machine you describe either.
As far as there not being enough plus sized patterns, I think you should start a plus size pattern company. If it is true that the market is there (and I believe it is) and it is so easy to make plus size patterns (either with your TNT or this programmable machine you know of), this strikes me as a license to print money so what's not to like? I'm telling you, you have several advantages we don't so why not go for it?
Starting your own pattern line makes more sense because it seems counter productive to try to strong arm someone you think hates you, or discriminates against you to make products for you especially if they already have customers who keep them busy. If they do it under duress, they'd probably do a crappy job or something passive aggressive. I can't speak for you but if a waiter spits in my soup, I don't want another bowl, I want another waiter -or another restaurant.
"I can't speak for you but if a waiter spits in my soup, I don't want another bowl, I want another waiter -or another restaurant."
ReplyDeleteThe irony kills me.
This is a really cute pattern. I'd love it if you do a tutorial when you make it with your TNT pattern.
ReplyDeleteI can't wait to see your version.
ReplyDeleteI almost bought this skirt pattern, but then thought it would be too straight for me.
I'm REALLY curvy.
I get a bit confused by your terminology. When you say TNT, it sounds like you are using a TNT as your sloper. In that case, why don't you make up a sloper, then you can do the flat pattern alteration you always do anyway, and since you are using a sloper, you can always get the looks you want, instead of being initially stuck with the design lines/ease of the TNT pattern.
ReplyDelete